JK vs. JL

[6DoF]

while i don't say this much ... i kinda have to agree actually with B. they WAY over did the electronic BS and trying to take the driving out of the driving with the JL manual. i have a buddy who works for jeep and just went thru a huge re-do to re-program and rework the manual for the JT cuz they were so **** the market even agreed.

manual's for life!

[Cobound]

Originally Posted by 6DoF

while i don't say this much ... i kinda have to agree actually with B.

I know that pained you greatly, but kudos for admitting you agree w/ me

[MBood82]

Originally Posted by champ

From a pure ice-cream retrieval, nice day only purpose? JK hands down.

I briefly owned a 2-door, manual, JK and I firmly believe it was a better driving experience than any manual JL I've driven. Some of the shortcomings of the JK can be alleviated with the correct aftermarket tidbits.

What were the major downsides? Driveability programming, like Matt mentioned further down? Or mechanical differences? The cable vs. direct shift difference I know has lead to some complaints with the shifter itself.

Originally Posted by 6DoF

there is no way i'd get a JK for any reason ... the JLs are just that much better i just don't think the value is there. on that note i'd get a TJ, or order a brand new base model. get the bare min, add a few bolt-on's, and sell it in a few years for basically what you have in it.

I'd get a TJ if I could find one that was affordable. Every one with minimal rust costs as much as a JK with the 3.6. The JK with the 3.8 seems to be the current low cost point. I like the idea of the advantages the JL offers with the improved suspension, ergonomics and everything else but I'm nervous that so many people seem to hate the manual. We won't back off of that requirement.

Originally Posted by Cobound

If a manual is a MUST - JK. Period. No question, none - and they are snappy, reliable vehicles.

JK > JL purely for the manual comments below? I mean, I also like the idea of spending less money... but it does seem weird to buy an 8 year old vehicle when a new one is really not that much less percentage of cost wise. Same reason to go with an 8-10 year old JK versus a 20 year old TJ.

Originally Posted by Cobound

If you want to look at cost, and consider a JK and JL are not that far off in the 2 door variety - I'd go with a JL and an 8spd auto hands down. Period.

No auto!

Originally Posted by Cobound

JL manuals blow hard, garbage, and you'll wonder WTF you wasted your time, money, and energy even considering it.

Are they failure prone? Difficult to drive? What specifically makes them so bad? I did a google search on their issues and mostly found people complaining about vague or hard shifting that seemed to be attributed to cable adjustments.

Originally Posted by Cobound

Don't you already have a sporty manual? I know you're hard core stick shift, but you should really go test drive one and see for yourself - the 8 speed kills. And if you already have a manual, why get another

We already have the Challenger, but why only one clutch pedal in the driveway when you can have two? Plus, that's the wifes car, this would be more for me. It's already a compromise that I'd have to drive it with a V6 for a period of time...

Originally Posted by 6DoF

while i don't say this much ... i kinda have to agree actually with B. they WAY over did the electronic BS and trying to take the driving out of the driving with the JL manual. i have a buddy who works for jeep and just went thru a huge re-do to re-program and rework the manual for the JT cuz they were so **** the market even agreed.

manual's for life!

So is it all electronics/tuning that are causing the seemingly widespread hatred on the JL?

[champ]

Originally Posted by MBood82

What were the major downsides? Driveability programming, like Matt mentioned further down? Or mechanical differences? The cable vs. direct shift difference I know has lead to some complaints with the shifter itself.

Mechanically? I despised the shifter feel and the clutch especially. Maybe I'm just a manly man used to high HP stick cars, but the heavier clutch on the JK was far easier to drive than the feather light clutch on the JL. I believe there have been numerous problems with the pressure plate on the JL clutch and corresponding recall(s).

Drivability programming? Just one complaint that is almost impossible to avoid in modern, manual transmission, cars - rev hang. I think it was far worse than the JK. Unfortunately, I believe rev hang is going to be inherent due to emissions.

The JL steering feel, even with the steel steering box and other updates, is not as connected as any JK I've driven and far worse than my last two TJs. I don't know what FCA did to ruin on-center steering on these things, but I sure hope they don't continue the trend with any new iterations.

For overall refinement and a quieter ride, the JL does win in this category.